Author: eschudel

Lynelle is a faculty member in the School Health and Human Services (HHS), in the Allied Health Technologies Department.  Since 2017, Lynelle has been a facilitator of the Interdisciplinary Education (IDE) Student Festival at Camosun College, and I wanted to talk to her about how the festival started, how it has evolved over the years, and where it is headed in the future. 

Lynelle started our conversation by sharing that the predecessor of the IDE festival originated out of a program review of the Medical Radiography program.  “One of the competencies being added by the Canadian Association of Medical Radiation Technologists (CAMRT) was around inter-professional communication.  The hope behind this competency was that if students are taught how to communicate inter-professionally at school, that skill will carry forward into their careers and ultimately improve patient-client outcomes because when practitioners communicate better, they can provide better coordinated collaborative care.”  Thus, a project-based course in interprofessional communication was born. 

The newly created course was MRAD 264, and Lynelle spoke passionately about its interdisciplinary nature. “Interdisciplinary education is about learning with, from, and about others – it’s peer-to-peer learning, and students were tasked with teaching other students about their profession and providing an integrated learning experience.”  In other words, students were not only working together within the course itself, but also required to communicate with students outside of the course.   “Students came up with the idea to run a mini conference on campus. They split into groups, and we ran four learning activities, inviting fellow Camosun students to come in and learn about our professions and about some of the unique challenges that we face, creating a moment in time where they could inter-professionally communicate.”  Students did not just run the conference itself, however.  They had to plan and market the event, ran a post-event pizza party (meaning they needed to get food safe certificates and organize food services), solicited donations, booked space for the event, etc.  The collaboration students engaged in went well beyond the course outcomes. 

Lynelle emphasized that every element of that conference was student produced, while she supported them to bring their vision alive.  “It was hard for the students because they wanted to be told what to do, and how they were going to be graded.  We spent a lot of time talking about how to accomplish a shared goal, how to organize their labour, how to ensure everybody understands their individual roles, etc.” 

The Dean of HHS and other college leadership attended that first mini-conference, and excitement grew.  Lynelle and others applied for and were awarded one of the Camosun Innovation Awards which gave them some budget to work with for the next year so students would not have to look for donations.  “The second year, we had enough money to do better promotion and to support participation from more students. That year, we went with poster-style presentations which are very common in health care learning.”  Then the following year they applied for another grant from outside of Camosun, and with that funding were able to build out the event even further.  During this time as well, students from more HHS programs were beginning to participate in the event. 

In 2019, although they didn’t know it at the time, they held the last fully in-person event.  “We had almost all of the health programs participating by that time and had to book off two floors of the Ewing building. We had both poster presentations and interactive displays as well as health and wellness activities – all student-led activities for the benefit of other students. We added a passport that listed all of the activities and each time you participated in one of them, you got a stamp. Students were then able to take that passport back to their instructors for bonus points or as part of a required activity in their courses.”  

But then, in 2020, COVID threw a wrench in the works when the college shut down shortly before the festival was to take place.  Because they couldn’t hold an in-person event they “pivoted in a dramatic way to a WordPress site where we posted all the presentation materials for students to interact with online.”  Lynelle reflected that, despite the stress, “ultimately that activity was quite successful and recording all of the work that we had intended to do under the circumstances was brilliant.” 

According to Lynelle, the level of engagement in this pandemic IDE was superficial, through comments on the site. But the next year, they took the online format and built on it.  “The following year we added another group of students to the mix – students in the Interactive Media Development (IMD)program in Computer Science which had been created by an interdisciplinary team at the College.  The purpose of bringing in the inter-professional practices course arose from an industry criticism of graduates from these types of highly technical programs that graduates struggle to communicate with clients.  We asked ourselves, I wonder what would happen if we put these IMD students in a situation where they had to learn with, from, and about students in a very dissimilar discipline: health.”  This was tactical as well, Lynelle noted, because health students tend to have lower technical expertise, although they are asked to work with electronic health records, digital imaging, app tracking, online health appointments. “Health students in general need to understand how technology works and how to communicate with the people who are building, maintaining, supporting technology in our workplaces.” Hence the decision to bring these two groups together. 

Lynelle didn’t teach the first IMD course, but she did the following year.  But because of low enrolments in that second pandemic year, they took the two cohorts of students (one from health and one from IMD) and combined them together into one section, a rare event with two cohorts of students in two separate Schools taking the same course.  It was a tough year, Lynelle said.  “We were all having a hard time with the pandemic, so what we did that year was refine the virtual-only experience. The first cohort of IMD students had built a brand-new website from scratch, collaborating with the health students and instructors; this section of combined students didn’t have the same capacity and we had to discover together what was possible.” And her additional challenge was teaching to two completely different groups of students.  “When you teach this particular course to a specific discipline, you work within that discipline’s perspective. But teaching from two perspectives is an interesting challenge. It was difficult for the students to grasp initially, but we walked through the steps and processes, convincing them of their own capabilities, and at about week eight or nine they started to see what was possible, and by week 13, they were pretty darn proud of themselves for what they had accomplished.” 

During this iteration, the virtual festival integrated more interactive elements into the website. In addition to the projects, the students included more information about different programs, they interviewed Dean of HHS about interdisciplinary education at Camosun and included some keynote speakers. The focus of the IMD students was peer-to-peer technical support for instructors and for students submitting projects to the website as well as providing troubleshooting support and updating the website.” And along the way, learning skills their profession had been criticized for lacking.  Lynelle was proud to report that the whole cohort of IMD students was immediately employed after graduation, and most were hired where they wanted to be hired. 

And now we come to the current year (2023).  “This semester, I’m teaching the course to Sonography students for the first time. And this year, the students are using H5P to develop an interactive virtual simulation that teaches their profession to people in other health care professions. The theme of this year’s interdisciplinary student festival, which will be held in the spring, is What we wish our colleagues knew: Get the scoop on our scope.”  Basically, students are looking at improving communication between professions, for example between nurses, care aids and allied health professionals, to reduce medical mistakes or miscommunications.  “The students created a simulation exercise: you click through it, learning bits here and there, watch some patient interactions, so at the end their peer colleagues should have a fundamental understanding of what sonographers need in order to do their job. And that’s the point of this student interdisciplinary festival – improving interprofessional communication.” 

As Lynelle and the IDE festival group think about the future, they are reaching out to the interdisciplinary education community of practice at Camosun College to see if there are ways to bring more students in to this kind of student-led learning for and about each other. “We’ve proven that it works with a group of students in a computer science program that realistically have no reason to take a health program, but this course does speak to one of their program outcomes explicitly.” To start, a student in Mental Health and Addictions has been interviewed by Lynelle’s students as a first step in learning about that profession, in hopes that “they will then be interested in learning more about us. Then maybe in the next iteration, they’ll be more interested in learning with us.” 

But it’s not just service-education programs Lynelle sees fitting in with the current model. “I want to learn how someone in Economics might see their students participating. When I think about how important economics is to funding our healthcare system, if economics students gained a better understanding of where they might fit in the world through collaborative learning and understanding, how would that improve our society? Because if we understand each other better, if we recognize not only what makes us different but what makes us the same, and what we need in order to work in a more collaborative way, I don’t think discipline matters so much – it’s about beginning to have those conversations.” 

And why shouldn’t anyone at Camosun be allowed and encouraged, and even required, to take an interdisciplinary communication course? “I would love for any student to be able to take this course and be able to participate in these kinds of activities – even to go so far as to create open programming where students could choose to take the courses that they’re excited to take.” Lynelle’s point hit home with me.  This course addresses an essential skill that ALL students should be engaged in learning.  “These are the skills employers are looking for – working with teams, working with clients – capabilities aren’t necessarily included in discipline-specific programs. Everyone who learns to take an X-ray can functionally execute an X-ray, but who can do it with the best client-centred care perspective? Who can interact with other colleagues in the department or interact with the other departments that we have to work with.?  This is why the IDE festival was born.” 

Lynelle concluded our conversation by telling me “I don’t know where this is going to go, but almost every single allied health, nursing, and health-related credential now includes some sort of inter-professional or interdisciplinary competency, so I think it’s here to stay in all those programs. But what about other essential courses? I would love to see, for example, a course about Indigenous history in every single program.  If we’re talking about the skills and capabilities that are going to help graduates function better as employees and be more attractive to employers, we have to look ways to incorporate those important topics and skills into the core of all our programs, so they are not something that students or instructors have to do off the side of their desk.”  That should be the future of education – whole and inclusive. 

Anthony is a faculty member in the Centre for Sport and Exercise Education (CSEE).  In fact, he was a brand-new term faculty member in the Fall of 2022 when I first heard his name from my instructional designer colleague, Kristina, who was amazed with the work Anthony was doing in his classroom around assessments and engagement activities.  So, last December, I sat down in Teams to chat with Anthony and Kristina about his experiences.

Anthony came to Camosun in a very roundabout way.  He was born in the U.S., was drafted to Major League Baseball at 17, received a scholarship for a Bachelor of Psychology program which he completed in 2011, got married and moved to Canada in 2012, completed a Master’s of Science in Kinesiology (after starting a Master’s or Education) at UVic, became a master coach developer for baseball in B.C. and Canada, then started applying to teach at Camosun.  After about two years of applying, he finally got the call one week before the Fall 2022 term started!

Anthony was hired to teach SPMA460, which is the Media and Public Relations for the Sport Management program, and with only four days to prepare, he was feeling a bit overwhelmed.  But fortunately he was able to meet with Kristina who introduced him to D2L, and helped him navigate the course syllabus, the assessments, etc. “I had the opportunity to work with several new term faculty in CSEE that semester and the first time Anthony and I sat down, I was captivated by his passion to give the students an authentic learning experience.”  Kristina mused that in our work as instructional designers, much of our time is spent “trying to help new instructors understand various approaches to teaching and how to inspire engagement in students. But Anthony brought all of that from his professional life so those first meetings were more about helping him navigate D2L and the college system versus actually teaching.”  Kristina found this a new experience for her “because Anthony was bringing so much expertise to the table already. We spent more time discussing higher-level questions and had deeper conversations about teaching that we as instructional designers don’t normally have until an instructor has had two or three years of in-classroom teaching experience.”

While Anthony has been a guest speaker and presented to rooms full of hundreds and thousands of people, he had never taught a course over a long period of time.  “I really wanted to do a good job because the classroom is an integral part of these students’ lives and I’m a part of it. I wanted to give them the best opportunity to learn from me and my experiences and my network.” For Anthony, this meant a lot of late nights.  “For the most part, I was finishing the lecture at 1:00 am the night before I was supposed to deliver it, as well as reviewing some of the content the night before so I could better guide the students.”  Because Anthony had less experience with some of the course topics, he brought in guest speakers to enhance the content. “My background in media and public relations was only from an athlete’s point of view.  For example, I had been a participant in press conferences, but I never had to set one up.  But thankfully the head of communications for BC Transit came in and shared some experiences from running press conferences for BC Ferries, etc.”

But Anthony reflected that his background as a coach and as a facilitator for the Coaching Association of Canada helped a great deal. “The rule of thumb is you talk 25% of the time and let the coaches speak the other 75%, and your 25% comes in by asking them questions to help them come up with a better answer. In my class, there were times the students didn’t want to talk, and I had to ask them very specific questions to get them going.”

Anthony also used a model he appreciated from his grad school days.  “We would break up a four-hour classroom day by doing activities throughout the four hours, as well as small group presentations. So, most days, I would plan an activity that wasn’t for a grade, where the students had to put themselves in a role-play type of situation. What I found, oddly enough, was that in-class participation during the ungraded activities was superior to that of the graded assignments because students were not stressed about being graded.”  So, the puzzle now becomes how to reduce that stress when students are being assessed for marks.

Another one of my colleagues, Derek, from the Faculty Development area, also supported Anthony.  “I asked him to come and observe the class, and we’ve since had some very deep conversations about teaching.  My big takeaway was that I wish I could start day one again and add more things to my delivery.”  But as Kristina noted, “the first time around, you’re figuring out the grading, what your expectations are, etc. Next time around you can work on the assignment instructions, the guidance you give the students, because you will be able to anticipate things that come up.”

One other thing I wanted to note about Anthony’s approach was that he had no hard due dates on any assignment.  Everything was ultimately due on the last day of class.  “If a student wanted to turn in their assignment 100 times, I would grade it 100 times and give it back so they could improve and get steadily better marks until they were satisfied. Some students have taken advantage of that – they turned everything in during the first week of class and we’ve been back-and-forth four or five times with me asking questions. On the other hand, some of the class has just appreciated that they could wait until the last minute and then hand everything in on the last day.”  While some students have commented that Anthony is just too nice, he notes that it’s not about being nice, it’s about supporting student learning.  “I want them to understand what they’re turning in so that if I ask them these questions two years from now, they’re going to remember, as opposed to if they cram and give me an assignment last minute. It’s made for some tough grading days, but I think the students appreciated my efforts.”

While Anthony admitted to having some concerns about the sustainability of this model if he were to be teaching multiple courses at once, Kristina assured him that “while the workload increases with more students, you’re able to anticipate, plan, and incorporate for that because you now have a solid foundation (and feedback from students) to work with, and each time you teach, you’re going to add another layer to it. I think if you had tried to add all those pieces at the very beginning, things may have fallen apart along the way. But because you started simple, you were able to deliver that exceptionally and in a way that you can now add too.”

Anthony doesn’t just think of his students inside the classroom.  He also sees his role as linking them with the right people for the information they need, or to help them move forward in their career, or help them discover another path they might want to pursue. “Athletes often don’t have mentors. They typically don’t start school with a job in mind, but rather think that for the rest of their lives they are going to play a sport, become famous, and make money.  But this only happens for a small percentage of those athletes.  So, this class is not just about what students learn, but it’s also about making connections, utilizing networks, and figuring out how this can propel them further. This class may take them somewhere that has nothing to do with media and public relations, but because of the connections they’ve made, they can go anywhere.”  In fact, one of Anthony’s dreams would be to have an entire course of just guest speakers.  “Nobody in the class knew what an agent does except for one student who was a professional baseball player and had an agent, but even he didn’t understand the nuances. We could bring in CEOs or general managers of sports teams – if we had a class full of guest speakers, I think it could be a huge benefit for the students.

Kristina ended our conversation with something I had also been thinking. “When you (Anthony) talk about your teaching, if feel like there is no boundary between the classroom and the real-world. You’ve taken down those walls and you’ve immersed your course material and your students within the context of what they would encounter in real life and connect those authentically rather than teaching the concept and then applying it to an artificial example. I think that’s something very unique you’re giving your students. You have a gift, and sometimes we don’t take the time to recognize those gifts in other people.”  I couldn’t agree more.

You will be happy to know that Anthony is back with Camosun this term, teaching more classes.  I am excited for his students and look forward to finding out what amazing things he is doing!

Nancy is a faculty member and counsellor at Camosun, and I would be remiss if I did not also mention that she has worked here for 45 years.  Over those 45 years, Nancy has filled a variety of roles. “While I’ve served mostly in direct service roles, I’ve also done some admin work in student affairs and student development and have also been chair of our department.  And I’m probably the only person at Camosun who’s worked with all six presidents.”  Nancy reflected that she has seen a lot of changes at Camosun and the experience of working from home and supporting students virtually during COVID was just one of many.  Just as one example, “when I first came to the college, one of my first roles was to look at women’s access to the college. At that time, there might have been two women on faculty and the majority of students were male. But over the years those demographics have grown and changed tremendously.”

When I asked how she adapted to working remotely, Nancy says she was relieved.  “I was getting information from my daughter [whose first degree was in microbiology and immunology] long before the decision was made to work off-campus. There were a couple of weeks where we worried about working so directly with people, when distancing physically was awkward, and also because we work in small offices that are not well ventilated, and deal with a lot of emotion. So, it felt very vulnerable.”

Once the counsellors moved to working from home, they found adapting to remote counselling challenging.  Before moving to Teams, the group worked with students over the phone.  “Very rarely would we have phone sessions with students prior to COVID – to get a sense of a person we felt it was better to meet with them in person. Losing that meant losing important visual information.  It was awkward at first and you really had to compensate for what you couldn’t see by listening carefully, for example listening to breathing more carefully, like when you lose one sense, you compensate by developing another.”  One of the most dramatic phone sessions Nancy had was when she was talking to a student who began to sound jumbled.  Nancy suspected something was wrong, and it turned out the student was suffering from carbon monoxide poisoning.  Fortunately, she was able to get help and pulled through ok.  Nancy mentioned that one advantage some of her colleagues noted with phone sessions was that “some students are willing to disclose more easily over the phone because they feel less vulnerable, because they’re not visible. I found that’s true often with male students – it seems to be easier for them to disclose more quickly when they can’t be seen.”

Eventually the counsellors switched from phone to video sessions.  “Teams, while there were some technical glitches, was good. However, it was more work for our counselling admin people to set up Teams interviews. We have a confidentiality statement that students initial in-person but doing this online adds another level of complexity. In addition, when confidentiality needs to be broken, for example if a student wants us to communicate with an instructor, we have to get their written permission to break confidentiality which can be stressful for students to manoeuvre virtually.” However, in spite of the challenges, Nancy has found that some students prefer the virtual sessions and now students are given a choice between being seen in-person, or through Teams, or by phone. “Giving students the opportunity to make their own decision as to how they want to meet sets the relationship off to a better start.”

While student choice was one benefit of moving to online service, using Teams carried with it some challenges as well.  “When we meet with students in person, they can see our environment and that we are honouring their confidentiality. However, they don’t see that when we’re working at home. I’m always very careful to say that I’m by myself, and only my aged cat is with me, that no one can overhear a conversation. For some of my colleagues who have families, ensuring that confidentiality was more of a challenge, so we did try to find places on campus where students could call in. I also think I had more conversations with people sitting in their trucks and cars, and some students would tell me that they had roommates or parents or families which made it difficult for them.”

One other challenge moving to this virtual model was losing the in-person resources of other employees at Camosun.  “We were not able to accompany a student over to the ombudsperson or have an instructor walk a student over to us. That transfer of trust is best done person to person.  So, we had to find new ways to do the same thing.   We added more check-ins and follow-ups, but it was harder to contact people to have them available when we did not know their schedules or where they were.”  Something Nancy noted as one of those little things you don’t think about it until it’s not there.

For herself, Nancy found some good things coming out of the past couple of years.  “I am less reliant on paper, and I think my tech skills have increased. In addition, I think the opportunity to reflect about what we’ve lost and gained, about what’s important to us, has been one of the biggest benefits.  It’s given us a chance to really look at what we value and what we want to keep and what we don’t want to keep for the future.”

All in all, while Nancy finds many benefits to working virtually with students and giving them that choice of how they want to meet with her, she told me “I think overall students prefer a traditional in-person learning environment because they miss the interaction and making new connections.”  She asked me “what do you remember about what you learned in your first year of university?”  After I thought about it, I said what I remember the most is being happy not to be in high school anymore.  She then told me “I ask that question often of people and no one ever says something that they learned in the classroom. It’s always, I learned how to socialize, how to drink beer, how to struggle with values. There’s so much learning that happens outside of the classroom.  And for students learning remotely, are they getting the same opportunities to learn who they are as a person? Post-secondary time is a really precious experience. It’s when young people are learning independence and what they learn during this time shapes them into adulthood.”

Interestingly enough, when I wondered if these past few years were the most challenging time for her in her years at Camosun, Nancy said no, the most challenging time she had at Camosun was when there was a fire in the Dawson building right before Labour Day, “and for an entire year, all of the registration people, advisors, counsellors, physical plant folks, International had to relocate and work elsewhere, and do their work in different ways (remembering that students were expected on campus right away to begin the fall semester), which became a great bonding experience.”  A more challenging time, but as she said to me, good training for the similar challenges that came via COVID.

Finally, if Nancy had any advice to give someone experiencing the kind of change we all faced over the past few years, she says “embrace it and learn from it. Learn about your resilience – we’ve all learned about resilience in a way that we hadn’t experienced before. And take the time to reflect on what’s important and what isn’t. And finally, trust the capacity of human beings to do the right thing.”